I'm still saving for my first bolt gun. In the process, I already bought a bipod, rear bag (not sure how to use it) and a Bushnell Elite 3200 10x fixed scope. I also got a few other things, but these are the things I put on the AR for now, to get used to using them.

I took the scope out to the range on Saturday and was trying to get it zeroed at 100 yards. What size groups should I set as a goal for my 16" carbine length AR at 100 yards? Also, how hard is it to hit the farthest steel targets on the far left at Angeles? Is that not a big deal to be able to hit those? How can you tell if you hit it? I couldn't hear anything and didn't see any dust . . . so I didn't think I was hitting it. But then when I would hold a little higher, I would see dust above the target. Same results holding it lower, except the dust would be below. I was proud of myself since it was the first time trying to shoot out that far but then thought, maybe its not a big deal. Those steel targets look pretty huge.

What you should expect depends on what ammunition your shooting. At 100yds you should be getting ~2moa 5-shot groups with that carbine. Shooting 55gr bullets to 600yds is not going to give the best results. Look for 68-77gr bullets, they have much better BC and retain velocity better. With 10X, it's going to be difficult to spot your hits at 600yds, as the .223 doesn't give much impact at that distance. When shooting to 600yd, we usually aim for the small pig on the far right side and shoot for a specific part of the pig.

You probably need to shoot with a buddy who spots your hits.
Then, start at the little pig at 600yds and pick a 2" rock on the hill behind it.
Roll that rock around on the hill and then pick another one.
Take turns shooting, calling corrections for your buddy and applying the corrections your buddy calls for you.

Thanks guys. Unfortunately I got into the shooting sport late in life and none of my buddies shoot, but I'll have my wife spot for me.

Lets us (the forum) know when and were you go shooting and I'm sure someone will meet up with you

Will do. I was going to look for Ben on Saturday but I felt like such a tool struggling to zero the scope. I wanted to try to exhaust all my ability before asking for help. I think I got it pretty close. I'm sure I'll have to work at it some more because the shots were a little high at 100.

Sounds like you are on a good path. Getting used to your scope is very important. Try and focus on understanding DOPE and what is happing when you shot. Is it windy, hot... What effect did that have from last time you went shooting.

You are correct the targets are large, much larger than what we would shoot. But given your current setup making consistent hits on them is not too bad. This done not mean firing 10 rounds and walking the bullets to the target. You should be able to hit the steel with the first round you fire at each line. Don't wast time shooting the same target over and over. Shoot one hit it then move to a target at a different range dialing your scope or holding overs the correct amount from your DOPE card.

I plan to come watch you guys shoot this Saturday because I have no idea how to keep track of DOPE. I've read about it here at length. I want to see it in action so I can put some application to the study.

roypark wrote:I plan to come watch you guys shoot this Saturday because I have no idea how to keep track of DOPE. I've read about it here at length. I want to see it in action so I can put some application to the study.

Sounds good... What ammo are you using? Have you ever used a chronograph to check the velocity?

264Charlie wrote:
Sounds good... What ammo are you using? Have you ever used a chronograph to check the velocity?

I have a bunch of PMC I got at a gun show. I'm sure its not the most accurate ammo but I don't reload . . . yet. We live in a condo and my wife is ok with guns but she balked at the idea of "making" ammo indoors. I'll have to figure something out though because reloading looks to be required for the long distance game.

And I've never used a chronograph other than at paintball. Are they expensive?

roypark wrote:
I have a bunch of PMC I got at a gun show. I'm sure its not the most accurate ammo but I don't reload . . . yet. We live in a condo and my wife is ok with guns but she balked at the idea of "making" ammo indoors. I'll have to figure something out though because reloading looks to be required for the long distance game.

And I've never used a chronograph other than at paintball. Are they expensive?

Here's a cheap one for $50. Even with 2 holes on the screen, it's a decent chrono. You will need it eventually.

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/show ... p?t=362919" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

And yes, reloads are a must in this game unless you want to spend $1+ per round of .308

khw9mm wrote:
Here's a cheap one for $50. Even with 2 holes on the screen, it's a decent chrono. You will need it eventually.

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/show ... p?t=362919" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

And yes, reloads are a must in this game unless you want to spend $1+ per round of .308

FTF in Lincoln, CA. Can't swing that. Maybe I'll invest in one soon.

You live a bit away from me but are welcome to reload at my place...

264Charlie wrote:You live a bit away from me but are welcome to reload at my place...

Dude, that's a generous offer. Thanks. I may in fact take you up on that but my goal is to change the wife's mind somehow. We have a loft above our living room that I use to store all my music gear, so I want to try to set my stuff up there.

roypark wrote:
Dude, that's a generous offer. Thanks. I may in fact take you up on that but my goal is to change the wife's mind somehow. We have a loft above our living room that I use to store all my music gear, so I want to try to set my stuff up there.

My wife will not let me out of the garage.

roypark wrote: FTF in Lincoln, CA. Can't swing that. Maybe I'll invest in one soon.

Missed THAT part...lol. Get settled with your reloading equip first and tell your wife you're actually saving money by reloading.

264Charlie wrote:
My wife will not let me out of the garage.

If I had a garage, I would volitionally never leave. I already told the wife that once we get a house with a garage, I'll set up a sofa, tv, fridge and an intercom system. She thinks I'm kidding.

Sorry to jump in, but I'm at about the same place. I'm looking at the drills you guys have "walking" the scope around and making sure it comes back to the zero you started with (provided you kept good track of your clicks). Are there any other tasks we poor souls who are stuck on a 100yd or 50/100yd combo range can do to practice?

My first idea what to cut bits of wood/cardboard, number and measure them, then go to the range and have my range buddy stick them at unknown-to-me distances from the bench and then use the scope and do the math and see how close my estimations are to the actual distance. I'm not sure the folks running the range would appreciate that though. I'd rather not wind up on TV for trying to range my neighbors car out the window of my house either...

Ideas? Comments? Good jokes?

wombat303 wrote:Sorry to jump in, but I'm at about the same place. I'm looking at the drills you guys have "walking" the scope around and making sure it comes back to the zero you started with (provided you kept good track of your clicks). Are there any other tasks we poor souls who are stuck on a 100yd or 50/100yd combo range can do to practice?

My first idea what to cut bits of wood/cardboard, number and measure them, then go to the range and have my range buddy stick them at unknown-to-me distances from the bench and then use the scope and do the math and see how close my estimations are to the actual distance. I'm not sure the folks running the range would appreciate that though. I'd rather not wind up on TV for trying to range my neighbors car out the window of my house either...

Ideas? Comments? Good jokes?

Take the time to work on your positional shooting; kneeling, sitting, offhand, weak-side, etc.
If you're already limited to 100 yards i don't see a point in range estimating those distances. Pick a target farther away than 100+ yards and practice dry firing through a window at it. I use my neighbors door handle to his house. Just triple check its unloaded please lol.

Okay, I haven't found the difference between offhand and weak-side. A little help?

wombat303 wrote:Okay, I haven't found the difference between offhand and weak-side. A little help?

Weak side means switching the side the gun is on. In other words, if you usually shoot with the rifle on your right sholder, weak side is with it on your left sholder. Weak-side off-hand is just weak-side while standing. Shooting weak-side is tough by the way.

StraightShooter wrote:Weak-side off-hand

Don't ever combine these words again.
Some crazy match director might hear you!

AR15barrels wrote:
Don't ever combine these words again.
Some crazy match director might hear you!

Lets see, you could do weak-side, 90 degree tilt off-hand. That would be awesome. 8-)

Yikes.

So Weak-side is firing on your non-dominant side from a rested position.
Off-hand is firing on your non-dominant side while standing/un-rested?

wombat303 wrote:Yikes.

So Weak-side is firing on your non-dominant side from a rested position.
Off-hand is firing on your non-dominant side while standing/un-rested?

Weak-side = non-dominant side / support side
Off-hand = Standing

Offhand: